Screen Time Stories

March 30th, 2022

Julie: This episode of Screen Time Stories is presented by Pinwheel, a healthy smartphone for kids.

I’m Julie, and as a parent, I’m sometimes overwhelmed by the challenge of raising my kids in the age of screens. Know what I mean? I want our next generation to have control over their technology now and as they grow into adults. 

Embracing technology in modern parenting is a must—our kids will log on whether we like it or not. But are you concerned that you don’t have the tools to help your child navigate the digital world?

Same here. 

I started off with a flip phone 20 years ago, and as technology evolved I had to teach myself how and when to limit my use. 

In other words, I will unlock my phone to see the forecast, but instead click the Gmail icon, text a couple of people, check the latest news, and set my phone down. Then I remember—what’s the weather this week? I don’t have the healthiest relationship with screens, and so I want my kids to develop better habits. 

I’m just a parent that wants to give my kids the best outcome in life, and I wasn’t raised with the tools to do that. Through this podcast I’ll learn alongside you as we talk to real parents and industry experts for guidance. 

Why should we do this together? Because raising kids in the digital age is a lot harder now than it was 20 years ago. Pew research says that two-thirds of parents in the U.S. feel this added struggle, mainly because of technology like smartphones and social media. 

Let’s lean into the challenges and joys of parenting with tech while we learn from the latest research and experts in the field. Let’s do this together. 

Welcome to the first episode of Screen Time Stories: Parenting Techniques for Raising Tech Natives.

Today we’re focusing on a topic that we all do to some degree---monitoring our kids screen time. It’s such a tricky piece of parenting! Technology changes so rapidly that I can barely keep up, let alone monitor every platform. 

So to help me get a better handle on monitoring devices, I’m talking to a mom in Atlanta named Krystyn to hear how she handles this with her teenage daughters. 

Then I’ll chat with our monitoring expert Titania Jordan, coincidentally also an Atlanta mom, who is the Chief Parenting Officer for Bark, which is a parental control software company that serves about 6 million kids---they know a lot about this subject!

Before we dive into all that, let’s take a broad look at monitoring. I’m willing to bet that this is something you started doing for your kids back when they were tiny babies. You regulated the amount of time they had in front of screens. The American Academy of Pediatrics used to say no screens for babies under the age of two, but they updated that standard and now approve of video chatting with loved ones that can’t be there in person. I want to point out that this follows a trend that you’ll start to notice---not all tech is equal! As technology continues to develop, it’s good to keep tabs on the quality of the content that our kids are consuming. Of course we’re not shutting down the remote Zoom call for science class, but it’s important for us to consider the value that our kids are getting from each type of technology before we bash it.

So limiting low-quality screen time is important. But there are lots of other ways that we can parent our kids in harmony with technology. When my kids ask to play a new game or watch a new movie, you can check out sites like Common Sense Media to get an understanding of whether it’ll work with your family. 

To help keep tabs and regulate their devices, you can purchase special products and software. This is something that, thank God, is growing in popularity. I spent years searching for a smartphone that my son couldn’t hack before we found the Pinwheel Smartphone while it was still in beta testing. Many parents use the parental control features built into their kids’ Androids and iPhones, or the parental controls found in the settings of video games like Fortnite. Even certain wi-fi routers can block inappropriate content. 

Just to bring this back to parenting basics though, treat your kids’ screen time just like everything else by joining them in what they find interesting, enjoy the time spent together, and talk about it! 

Hi Krystyn, thanks for joining me. Krystyn has a Bachelor’s and Master’s in Chemistry, but stepped away from teaching about 10 years ago. She now runs a blog called “Really, Are You Serious?” and does graphic design. She and her husband have four daughters, ages 7-15.  

Both of Krystyn’s teens have Bark on their computers and Pinwheel Smartphones. Bark monitors lots of platforms, including text messages, Spotify, Gmail, and popular social media apps for signs of danger and sends alerts directly to parents. Pinwheel Smartphones are built with no web browser and gives parents the ability to limit the phone’s functionality and apps.  

Krystyn added software monitoring when she saw concerning messages about mental health issues from another child. 

Krystyn: Our kids haven't really searched for anything inappropriate, but I like knowing that it's there. I was like, I can't be on this and catch everything and something these things need to be caught like, you know, quickly. So once there was an issue, I went ahead and added bark. 

And we told her that was one of the conditions of having a phone is that your text messages can be monitored. And she knows almost all of her friends. Like, even if they don't have a pinwheel, the parents monitor their text messages, they have a phone turning in and, you know, look at it 

I try to think back and like I don't remember any friends like at school that had mental health issues and maybe we just didn't talk about it enough. But like, I don't remember, like, a friend passing me, a note that was like, I'm going to go jump off a bridge, you know, and that's kind of things that we’re seeing and those are the things that I want to keep an eye on. 

Those are the things that are concerning to me or like if somebody and this hasn't happened. But if somebody was like, Hey, I can get you a vape pen because that's a big thing. You know, like I want to know that those things are happening.

Julie: So your girls know that you’re keeping an eye on things. You’re not snooping through their private diary of thoughts because they know that you have the ability to see everything they send and receive. I think that’s fair. But when do we stop? My son is 13, and I don’t want him to be the only kid at college that can’t do his own laundry or can’t behave himself online. I want our kids to have the opportunity to learn gradually. 

Krystyn: You know, it's even like basic phone skills, like answering the phone, because they don't answer a house phone. My kids don't know how to answer the phone, you know? When I would be like, "Hey, can you get my phone? It's Daddy." They would just be like, "Daddy!" Hey, you say hello, you know, and realizing, yes, they need to be coached through the whole bit. 

I don't know. I think that my hope is keeping the communication open and her knowing that it's being monitored for, you know, the next year or however long we decide to do it. 

She'll tell me things. Like I picked her up one day from practice and she was like, "Mom. This is what happened. It wasn't me." Because she knew that I was going to see something that was pretty concerning and she came and told me, you know, before I saw it. So, hopefully kind of again, keeping that communication open. I think that's really what it comes back to. 

And I hope that the monitoring is really more of like a monitoring for things that they just in their 15 year old brain with this whole part--front part---not developed, don't think are worrisome. You know what I mean? Like she wouldn't even recognize that something that I see is concerning. Does that make sense? 

Julie: It makes total sense and you just made me think that there might be an added benefit to monitoring. Because when your daughter knows that you're going to have eyes on her messages later, or maybe an alert will pop up on your phone and you've already seen it, she's coming to you with this uncomfortable conversation. It's putting her in this position where she feels like she needs to start this conversation that she probably doesn't want to have. And then based on your reaction, it might end up being this very positive thing to her. So it's almost like setting up a habit. So that one day when you don't monitor her stuff anymore. Maybe she has this feeling that, "Something weird happened. I'm going to go talk to Mom about it because in the past, I've had these conversations that were not comfortable for me to have, but my mom has been the rock through the situation."

Krystyn: Well, you know, I think that's the thing with kids though, isn't it? They're afraid of the reaction. They're afraid of getting a negative reaction. They come to you and they're like, don't be mad.

Julie: No, it's so good when they say that, though. Because then it's like, "I got this. Mom level 100"

Krystyn: Because like if you're in a car like this conversation is going to happen. This is to say one thing that I have noticed is that time and in the car like driving to and from school. Like I've read that there's like you can have more conversations when you're not making eye contact with your kids. There's something about that looking forward. So we end up having more conversations in the car. We can talk about who was texting who and what drama there might be school, and what's going on at practice, or what's going on with the team. Or, you know, just any of those things that like they can talk about when their little sisters aren't around to kind of eavesdrop and ask lots of questions. So, you know just having that time and the car is a mixed blessing, you know.

We want it to be where they'll talk to us. So nothing is off limits. If it's something related to their body, if it's something about a relationship, if it's something where they heard somebody talking about drugs or vaping or you know, any mental illness---I want them to feel okay, saying, "I had a bad day."

We have to keep talking to each other.

Julie: Yeah, and not just you and I, but as a collective.

Krystyn: Yeah, it's helpful. It's helpful, you know, nobody's perfect. And we're all just doing our best and sometimes we just need an idea.

Julie: It’s so important to keep communication open with not only our kids, but also with other parents. I don’t know if it’s just me, but I feel like the Instagram-perfect families are being replaced by real people, making mistakes and just being human. Thank God. Krystyn’s definitely in the “real person” category and I’m grateful that she took the time to inspire me to be a better parent. 

My other guest today is Titania Jordan, a mom to a 12-year-old son (and two fur babies) and she’s the Chief Parenting Officer at Bark.  

Hi Titania! Thank you so much for joining me as our expert on today’s episode. I have so many questions that I’d love to hear your thoughts on, but first, I want to hear a bit more about you. So tell me what. What did make you want to work for Bark? 

Titania: A lot of things, you know. I'd spent a large part of my career in the startup space at the intersection of parenting and tech. So from just a business and life standpoint, it was a very intentional decision. I did not take lightly and then obviously, the major obvious thing is just the mission. I mean, you and I were talking about this just a few moments ago. But social media, you know, I, I'm addicted. Social media less so now than I used to, because I have worked to not be, but just that hamster, in a wheel, got to remove the notification mentality.

It's real. And I'm an adult. I know how to do certain things and protect myself against certain things. Yet. I'm still susceptible to algorithms and gamification, and I have to be aware of my mental health and all that's involved there with anxiety, depression, suicidal ideation, the comparison trap, body image dysmorphia, and eating disorders. 

All of that is so real to me as an adult. So combining what I know and what I knew would be facing our children, it just made me want to jump all in with Bark. And here we are. And I am so, so thankful for the opportunity and so grateful for all that we do. 

Julie: So when you say that you're personally struggling or you have struggled in the past with the way that social media, and these other platforms can pull you in, do you ever feel like you can attribute that to the way that we were raised? Like, I feel like you're probably about the same ages. Me. I grew up. I got a flip phone when I was about 16, and so having the internet and then Facebook and all of these things, gradually added onto my phone---this little device I could take anywhere with me---I feel like my parents didn't have the opportunity to role model tech behavior. And so now that you and I have kids and we're able to see some of the harms that come from it, do you think that this is going to be beneficial to our kids when they become our age? Do you think that they'll have a better handle on controlling their consumption?

Titania: Absolutely. Yeah. I mean we're, you and I are, I would say, one-of-a-kind generation that is straddling pre- and post- social media. We knew what it was like to be able to go home from school and not have all that follow you on Snapchat and through text threads and stuff. Our children don't, and no other child will in history. And so we're at a unique disadvantage, but also a unique advantage, and our children are very resilient. They will respect our insights, but they'll also have their own. They will be able to help their children navigate social media and tech in a way that we weren't, just because we were learning it at the same time as them. 

Julie: That’s so powerful to say it follows you home from school. When you put it together---my life versus my kids lives---something about that sentence just gave me the willies. A lot of parents are figuring out how to parent with tech. But we’re not really sure how or when to do it, since it’s all so new. When it comes to monitoring our kids’ devices, can you give us a handle on how we should approach this? 

Titania: We don't feel that you should, you know, be spying on your kids and snooping on your kids and being a helicopter parent. You know, trolling every little bit of everything in their lives because you know, the more control you do exert, they're just going to find a way to hide it. They're going to circumvent It. You'll push them away.

The goal is to build a relationship with them. The goal is to not shy away from the fact that you are their parent, you are responsible for their protection, for their growth and development. When they encounter some tough stuff, if you just block everything, that's not going to work out for you. Just TL;DR. Even if the best case scenario is you have successfully avoided anything bad coming across their eyeballs, by the age of 18, they leave your house and go to college. And it's like, "Whoa. Whoa, what, what is all this?" There needs to be some balance. 

Julie: So the main goal is to build a relationship with our kids while they’re living at home. And by monitoring their devices, we’re giving them access to certain things that they want, but we’re still parenting in that space. How does Bark support that?

Titania: So, you know, at Bark, we send parents alerts when their children have encountered dangerous things, but we don't give full unfettered access to every device on the account. You do have to have a little bit more control because there are just things that they don't know yet, and they can so easily stumble upon.

Julie: Yeah, it is challenging. That's an understatement. It's challenging as a parent to keep ahead of what my kid has access to and not only knowing what the most popular apps are and what platforms are dangerous or, you know, there's a whole list of things. But then also, having to figure out how to use all of these parental controls effectively. Is there a certain age that we should let our kids start accessing the different types of technology?

Titania: There is no good answer because every child is different. Every child is different. You know, mental health struggles and challenges to overcome and they just grow and develop at different rates so it's just not easy. 

Julie: Yeah, and so like you said a moment ago, it's really about that relationship that you have with your kid. You know your kid better than anybody else. So there's no magic age where it's appropriate for them to get their first cell phone or get their first social media account. It's really based on knowing your kid

Once you do open up those permissions, would you recommend that every kid has their screen time monitored, or is it best for certain kids? What are your thoughts there? 

Titania: I think it's best for every child to have their screen time monitored within reason. And monitoring is a pretty umbrella term---monitoring can mean just time spent online. Are they spending 10 hours a day online? That's probably just not healthy for them physically because all of us need to move around and not be sedentary. Monitoring can mean access to harmful content. And again, as your child matures, and has age-appropriate curiosity, you can dial back some of some of those implementations that you put in place.

Monitoring also encompasses the dangers that are happening. And by dangers, I mean, cyber bullying: are they bullying somebody else? Because yes, good kids, make bad choices, you know? Your kid is not always going to be the victim. They might bully some other kid, or they might be on a text thread and happen to be a bystander. Is your child struggling with mental health, or are their peers, and is your child adequately, able to support a peer who is anxious, depressed, struggling with suicidal ideation? Probably not. There's a lot to it. But yes, you know, you are responsible for your child's health and well-being until they are 18, legally. So part of that is their digital world and their digital lives. So you need to be a parent there as well. 

Julie: So it sounds like we should keep tabs to some extent on our kids’ screen time, which I know will be different for each kid. This is added pressure as a parent though because our kids’ devices unlock so many doors that they otherwise wouldn’t have access to. 

Titania: You need to help them. You also need to keep in mind, it's not all about being heavy handed. That you as a parent, your children need grace. They're going to make mistakes. Their frontal lobes are not fully formed. Think about all the bad choices we made as teens and tweens and in young adulthood, really. Let your child know that, no matter what happens, no matter what bad choices they made, mistakes they made, or no matter what bad, terrible thing has maybe been done to them, they are not a bad person. You love them unconditionally and you'll navigate this with them together. Most children will not come to their parents or caregivers would troublesome issues because, you know, they catastrophize. They're afraid of how it'll be handled or they just don't want to talk about it cause it's uncomfortable.

Let your child know that it's okay if they make a mistake, and you're there for them.

Julie: I love that sentiment. We’re all going to make mistakes, and I know that if I can’t extend grace to myself, I won’t be able to give it to my kid. I know for me, staying level-headed can be hard when things are going downhill fast. Can you tell us how we should handle that conversation? What did you say to your son? 

Titania: I spoke to my son and I was like, "Hey, buddy. I got a bark alert. I'm not going to call anybody's parents, but I just want you to know that I am not the only person who might be getting the sort of alert. Your friend's parents might also get Bark alerts. Your friend's parents might not have Bark and go through their kids phones. You have to know that whatever you're saying to somebody digitally is probably not only going to be seen by just them, even even if it's a disappearing message. You just have to pretend like anybody in the world can see what you're saying or doing at anytime. And so on that note, these words that were said, these pictures that were sent, these names that are shared... I know that your [insert age here] brain can't fully grasp the ramifications. But what if grandma saw that? If your grandma were to read that, you would probably be pretty embarrassed, right? You wouldn't speak that way to her. You wouldn't speak that way to a teacher. You wouldn't speak that way at church." 

And it's that conversation. It's more than once. I can't just have that conversation once be like, "Okay, and my kids can make good choices from now on." It's going to be a constant reminder. And honestly, there are probably going to be a few instances where he does get in trouble and not necessarily from me, but, you know, maybe one of his friends parents see something. There will be ramifications for bad choices that are made, and sometimes they'll listen to us and sometimes they just have to experience it for themselves. 

Julie: And so there is an element there I want to point out. I think it's important to keep the balance of it's not all dangerous and all the scary all the time. 

Titania: No, it's honestly a way to relate, because that is his world. That is his reality. So as much as I'd like for him to be just reading books all day, he's not. So if I would like to have conversations with my child. I need to try to make it relevant to his world and his peers. 

Julie: Do you have any tips for how parents can stay ahead of their kids in the ever-changing tech landscape? 

Titania: We've got to give our kids credit because they really are like little FBI agents. They're like little secret agents and they're figuring stuff out. And that's cool. Right? It shows initiative. And I applaud that and I appreciate that. Whenever my son has been able to hack something, I'm like, "Hey, good job problem solving, but you're still, you know, there are consequences because you broke the rules."

That said, use the internet as your best source of information. If you don't know what something is, if your kid is using words, like "sus" and "bro" and "dabs" Google it. Figure out what the heck they're talking about. If you see them using an emoji a lot, figure out what it means. For example, the plate of pasta noodles, you know, they're not the next chef. That could stand for nudes, like send nude photos. And so you need to stay on top of these things.

Julie: Bark has a great blog that gives up-to-date information on the latest trending topics. There’s also a couple of Facebook groups, Parenting in a Tech World and Thriving Families, Healthy Tech where parents can ask each other questions and give each other advice based on their experiences. 

But with the Bark software, it’s really neat that Bark actually guides parents. When they send an alert, they also give advice on how to talk through that certain topic with their kids.  

Titania: Because we need, we will take all the help, we can get. It's all. It's a new frontier. We've never, as parents, we have never had this dynamic to parenting. And so we need help. We need help from parents who have been there and done that. We need help from therapists and mental health, experts and children's health and wellness professionals.

Julie: I know I need all of the help I can get! Thank you so much for sharing with us today. My key takeaways are that I need to monitor my kids’ devices and keep conversation flowing with lots of grace. And just like with every other piece of parenting, my main goal is to build a relationship with my kids. 

Screen Time Stories is presented by Pinwheel. Pinwheel reimagined the smartphone experience to support healthy child development, and therapists backed the design. By removing web browsers and social media, promoting focus and intention through the interface, and curating dozens of apps to promote wellness, Pinwheel helps children develop healthy, lifelong boundaries with technology. 

Special thanks to Titania Jordan for giving us her expert insight. You can find out more about Bark by visiting Bark.us. Also thank you to Krystyn for giving us a glimpse into her real life; you can check out her blog at Really, Are You Serious .com. Last, thank you to our story editor Shelley Delayne for overseeing this episode. And thanks to you for listening! Let me know what challenge with technology your family is facing by emailing me at julie@pinwheel.com.

We’ll share a new episode next week on social media.